Multi-Site Churches…Kind Of Like Extra Limbs?
Multi-site churches are not new, but they are definitely being talked about more.
What is a Multi-Site church? Well, it would be a church that is one entity, but has multiple locations. Some of you may be familiar with some of the big Multi-Site churches like, Lifechurch, North Point, Crosspoint or Granger. Just to name a few. It is different than a church plant, in that a church plant is often looking to sever it’s relationship to become independant. Multi-site churches most often retain and interpendance on tha main organization, or main campus.
So what is the point of a multi-site church? That can be a very complex question to answer, but generally a multi-site church is one that looks to be a presence in more places than one. Some are born out of the need for more space. Some are born out of the “church planting” process. Some just start with the idea to have multiple campuses. Whatever it is (and there are 100’s of reasons) the intent is to have a greater impact.
That phrase generally conjures up lots of opinion. Let me start by saying this. I am in favor of Multi-Site churches. For many reasons. Most definitely for the “Impact” reason.
I am curious though. How many of you have had experiences with a multi-site church?
Has a multi-site church affected you? good or bad?
Do you work in a multi-site church? What can you share about it?
Let me have it 
The only one I’ve had IRL experience with is Hillsong. It’s one of the few multi-site churches in Australia – maybe the only one?
I love what they are doing with their CBD campus (currently experimenting with meeting in the awesome Capitol Theatre while they sort out all the legal wrangling on their new building proposal) by reaching an area of the city that is traditionally served only by ye olde worlde churches – which I love too, I’m a chorister at heart, but let’s be a bit more real world in our missional focus, please.
The CBD is the heart of Hillsong’s social justice ministries (rock on Christine Caine!), and having a church presence alongside this I believe is making a big impact.
Sure, a lot of people still travel from all over the city to get there – you’re always going to get that – but it’s going to be interesting to see where multi-site churches head in this country.
David (@dg4G)´s last blog post…Authenticity
We attended a multi-site a couple of weeks ago, and it was… different. The worship was live (and great, may I add) and the sermon was spot on – very good – but it felt a little weird to watch it on a screen instead of live. Not sure if it is something I would get used to or not.
I guess if what the “parent” church is doing is working, why re-invent the wheel? Seems to be working for lots of folks. My only question would be whether the congregation would still have the access to the pastor, or if there is an “on-site” pastor to help them.
Jennifer´s last blog post…Want a good laugh?
Jennifer, I think the “video venue” style churches are definitely not for everyone. Glad you enjoyed your experience.
I’ve visited Buckhead Church in Atlanta (North Point campus) several times and it feels no different to me than any other church I’ve visited. Sure, I couldn’t walk up to Andy Stanley after service, but I wasn’t there for him. I was there to hear what God had given him to share. I know it isn’t for everyone and some people like the idea of having a pastor who is accessible and they can just drop by the office any day of the week and talk to him, be counseled by him, etc. I had this conversation with my aunt the other day because her church is relatively small. Everyone knows everyone, the church itself is practically a small group. So after I returned from visiting Fellowship Church she asked, “That’s just too big; how many people there can say they’ve even met Ed Young, let alone know him personally?” I explained how the church isn’t about WHO is pastoring, but WHAT God is doing through them and the church. I’m actually glad I didn’t mention that they’re multi-campus as well, since her question was concerning the size of the main campus.
Jonathan´s last blog post…Road Trip
Jonathan, that is an incredibly valuable discussion to have. I don’t think “accessibility” has a lot to do with it. Even with a live Pastor, there is no way for that Pastor to be accessed by everyone. Thanks for your thoughts.
Back again – just to clarify in case people don’t know the Hillsong model:
1. Everything is live at each campus…different band, different preachers, etc. There’s no projecting in from the Hills campus to the city, for example
2. Brian Houston only personally pastors his leadership team (6 people)…it’s a tree going down from there. In reality, it’s a whole bunch of home churches which come together corporately to be “refueled”…your pastor may not be the person preaching. And lets face it, often teaching and pastoring are two very different things (gifts)…a whole other discussion to have if it’s not already been done.
David (@dg4G)´s last blog post…Authenticity
Glad you clarified that. I was curious if hillsong did video teaching.
My opinion would depend on whether we are talking about video preaching or not. Because that is a totally other beast than just a multi site church.
Tyler´s last blog post…The New Fundamentalism
True, but very much a part of multi-site. So, what are your experiences with it?
i work for a church that is multi-site, video teaching. we broadcast live over IP so the sermon is still live (albeit on video) at our satellite campuses. everything else is live however; music, announcements, drama (if we have one), all of it. each campus has it’s own specific campus pastor, campus associate pastor, and arts pastor (and a variety of other staff members).
we did it because we outgrew our building. and we believed that taking church to the people, and NOT building a bigger building and making people come to us, was the best thing to do. it’s been a HUGE win for us.
granted. it took some getting used to on the video teaching. we started off doing “tape delay” where our first campus would just use a dvd on sunday of saturday night’s services. i wouldn’t recommend this to ANYONE. the fact that we are live now has added so much, it’s really quite incredible.
from a staff standpoint, it can be quite difficult. you are essentially breaking into three campuses when you open your first multi-site. campus a, campus b, AND central support. so it takes some time to get your footing and really know where you’re at. it relies heavily on amazing volunteers stepping up to support it, as whatever you’re doing live you’re basically now doubling up.
but it is an INCREDIBLE journey. i know we wouldn’t have been able to do it as well as we have without some amazing support and advice from those that have done it before. we relied heavily on people from seacoast and lifechurch to help us through some of the early days, and we still are in regular contact with seacoast.
hope that was somewhat informative and not just a big long rant
joshua´s last blog post……this type love (for ryanne)
You rock!
You and I have talked some about multi-site before, but what I want is all of your expertise on Video over IP. We need to talk about this.
anytime
hopefully soon we can do it over a coffee or scotch
joshua´s last blog post……this type love (for ryanne)
Calling
i like lip gloss.
your awesome wife´s last blog post…how do you talk to someone about God…
Do you mean like a church with multiple branches? If so, then I attend one. The Apostolic Faith church originated in Portland, OR and now has branches all over the US as well as other countries (Korea, Romania, Canada, etc.). We have our headquarters in Portland, but each church has it’s own Pastor, orchestra & choir, and staff. Every summer we have a 2-week Camp Meeting in Portland (as well as a few other sites around the world and in the US) for people from separate branches to come together and fellowship.
I think for the most part it is a very positive thing to have so many others that share our beliefs. The only negative that I have seen is that many people from the Portland church are more inclined to act like they are, um, higher up than those that attend smaller branches.
Mandy´s last blog post…Grace, Take 20
Mandy, that is more church planting than multi-site. Many denominations plant churches that adhere to the “main” denominational doctrines and such. That’s more what you guys would be doing. And, it is a bummer when one church treats another in a negative fashion.
So, is this the ‘new thing’ we’re headed for?
Personally, I’d prefer a church plant, and we’d go with Ron in a milli-second !! (I don’t think we’d have a problem with other ‘willing volunteers’ either).
No video please (I prefer interacting with God live on site =).
D-
D, I can assure you of two things. We won’t be “planting” a church and we will never have God on video
This is a very interesting discussion. My family and I attend a very small Presbyterian Church. 147 members, an average Sunday attendance is 100 plus. My wife and I really like the intimacy of our church. That in no way makes a large Church or a Multi-Site Church less important to us. Both big and small churches can still effectively do Gods work. When you mention video teaching, do you mean actually watching a sermon on a screen on Sunday morning?
Bryan, video teaching would be exactly that. Most often, churches that use video teaching are broadcasting the sermon from the main campus to the satellite campuses. So, the satellites are watching either a live or recorded message.
My dad pastors a church that recently opened a second location that meets on Sunday nights. They’re a small/medium size church, so chose the Sunday night time to make it possible for same speaker & musicians to do all services on Sundays. It’s a killer weekend for whoever is ‘on’, but they’ve moved to a shared preaching model, so it’s not wearing anyone out. They also hired a staff person specifically to be the campus pastor for the new location. He is one of the speakers in rotation.
Oh, and they don’t have anyone on staff for music and worship. It’s all volunteer. I don’t know how they do it!!!!
The ‘why’ for this congregation: initially, the decision to go multi-site came out of space needs. They chose to do this instead of doing a huge remodel/addition to their main campus. They pursued several locations in their town for a couple of years, all of which fell through. The opportunity to create something in the location they now have literally fell in their lap through what can only be described as a series of miracles. It is not a location anyone would have selected to begin a new ministry. But God is springing up vision and people and opportunity where there was only, like, NOTHING before.
If I was going to be a part of something like this, I’d love for it to be that obviously God’s will. Amazing.
Kim Bontrager´s last blog post…Holy Week Journey 2008: resources
“Oh, and they don’t have anyone on staff for music and worship. It’s all volunteer. I don’t know how they do it!!!!”
That’s CRAZY! Can be done, but from a logistical side, but from a personality side, not sure that could work.
The “why” sounds a lot like us. We are struggling with space issues right now, but are not interested in spending money to remodel or build.
Just a note on this volunteer stuff…we are currently in the total volunteer model for everything. The senior pastors are the only full time staff, we have two part-time admin, and I get paid for the work I do on the accounts (but not sitting on the board or being music director).
We’ve just hit 400 members (350 there each week) and growing >20% each year for the past three.
We’re looking at buildings (we rent an old theatre at present) and staffing how to change this, but all the current leaders of depts (myself included) are in fairly lucrative employment and certainly have big mortgages (like anyone in Sydney)…making it all add up is fun. I have thought about selling up and living a less-expensive life to enable employment by the church…but I’ve seen too often what happens in that model too.
I know I lack faith that it won’t happen to me, God and I are working on that…
David (@dg4G)´s last blog post…Snubbed. Gobsmacked. Bewildered.
David, I think there can be value on both models. The Full time and part time minister. But, I believe that all should be volunteering and working together.
But, it is more than greeting and handing out bulletins. Where I think we get it wrong sometimes, is to say that, this kind of volunteering is enough. I believe that relationship with your neighbors is the key. That is where “volunteering” needs to be poured out. If you are to be a greeter at a church, it is to be a person that is welcoming and getting involved in the lives of those around you as they walk through the doors.
And that’s one area where our church gets it right – reaching out to the community.
It’s then the balance of what you do for a living vs your service and making sure we don’t fall into the trap so many do of overdoing one or the other, or both. I can see signs of it around me, and in me too. Managing the flock while it grows is tricky (and I know a bit about that on the literal shepherding side too, being a country boy originally…ha!)
Currently, I’m waiting on my copy of Mad Church Disease to arrive…
David (@dg4G)´s last blog post…Snubbed. Gobsmacked. Bewildered.
I know people that put “volunteering” on a pedestal and then in turn ruin relationships and the family. We’ve always said, God, then Family, then work, then ministry.
I love hearing what you guys are doing!
I had been a part of multi-site church for 15 years. It was effective in that in met needs of the community they were planted in and that was the whole purpose. The church I was a part of had a pastor that preached in those sites. What I see alot of today and don’t feel is as effective, is a video satellite from the main campus. People need to be connected with the pastor to be able to reach out and touch, speak, get a hug, prayed for, hand laid on. I wonder with all the leadership in the main campus why are they not sending out those leaders to the satellite campus to connect with the people…they need it as leaders just like the congregants need it.
Why do you think video is not effective?
I don’t personally know of any campus doing video, that does not have “live” people there. All the sites I know of are sending out leaders to connect with the campuses.
There are churches who do the video sermons. I work as a ministry consultant so I come across them. Video is not AS effective but I guess it depends what they people are wanting. If you are ok with a video stream and it works for you then cool, if not then that would not work for you to be at weekly.
I would say that poorly done…anything is not as effective. But quality is quality. Not sure effective is a good word for this. But I do believe that not all can bee affected by video.
i agree, “effective” is an AWFUL word for this.
tell lifechurch.tv that they’re video teaching isn’t effective.
tell our toledo campus, which is video teaching and averages 1,800 a weekend at only a year old that it’s not effective.
tell the 60 people we just baptized at our toledo campus a couple weeks ago that video teaching isn’t effective.
are there some churches/people who aren’t going to get it? absolutely, and that’s ok! but i think making broad generalizations about whether or not video teaching is effective or worthwhile is CRAZY dangerous.
joshua´s last blog post……this type love (for ryanne)
That is also the point of having a “campus pastor” – there is someone for people to come to.
The other thing that is so beneficial to this model is that there are some people who are great leaders/administrators who can lead a multi-site, but they are not gifted at consistent, weekly communication…
I agree Joel. There has to be that connection.
We started a multi site a couple years ago. The real reason we went with it was because we had a core group of people coming from that area – 30-40 people. Their region didn’t have any churches that were reaching the same type of people we were and these people really wanted to impact their area.
After some time of planning/praying/etc. we launched there. We are currently capturing straight into an iMac (sat night), then taking the iMac over to that campus Sun morning to playback from it. It has worked great! but if we add campuses, we’ll have to adjust this…I’d love to hear more about what you’re doing Joshua.
We are a very volunteer driven church, so we have a campus pastor there and everything else is covered by volunteers. I basically give them everything I’m doing at our main campus and they make it happen – that means I had to get much more detailed with the charts for the songs…I map everything out now so they can read straight through it.
In the future we would probably use multi-sites to cannibalize our main campus – freeing up seats like Joshua mentioned above.
Joel, very cool. Glad to see that your church saw a need and went after it. I do think planning is HUGE! I don’t see how there can be good communication on a satellite campus if there is poor communication on the main campus.
joel – send me an email anytime and i’ll help out however i can. joshua@loveisgreaterthan.com
joshua´s last blog post……this type love (for ryanne)
Tough issue.
I personally would perfer to see a church plant, for a variety of reasons. First and foremost, it’s a biblical model. Paul went about and planted churches. The early church grew out of church plants.
The Great Commission calls us to “send.” Jesus prepared his disciples – all of them, not just the twelve – to be sent into the mission field.
A church is much more than a building, a worship service and a preaching. It is about people. The church IS the people in the building. Relationships should be forged, bonds built, etc. How does that happen in a multi-site church? How does a guy in a side campus get to know his senior pastor?
I like the Hillsong approach, and would not call it a multi-site church. I look at it more as a network of churches. Each one has it’s own fellowship and church life and identity. The leadership is accountable to the “mother church” – but then ALL pastors should be accountable.
The biggest danger I see in a multi-campus church is the possibility that they become followers of men instead of followers of Christ. If a pastor has done his job correctly – all of his job – then as his congregation has grown, he has poured into the lives of leaders as Christ poured into his disciples. Then when the church has outgrown it’s walls, it has discipled, trained, prepared leaders to send to a new place.
There is nothing wrong with accountability to a sending church, a shared vision, mutual support. In fact, those things are necessary in a successful church plant. A church plant is not “set and forget.” But the goal and vision of a congregation should be to stand in it’s own identity – and to send more people. Just my $.02
Don’t even get me started on video preaching….
Mike Mahoney´s last blog post…The Music Licensing Quagmire – Part 1 – A Primer
Mike, what makes you think a satellite campus is not a church plant? Just the video portion?
Also, I think you and I would see things pretty similar on the great commission, except that I believe it to say “go”…not “send”. Although send is very much a part of it.
“A church is much more than a building, a worship service and a preaching. It is about people. The church IS the people in the building.”
This is exactly why we would as a church would consider planting satellite’s around our valley. We do not want to build up the main campus, we want to go into each community in our area to have a greater presence and impact.
“The biggest danger I see in a multi-campus church is the possibility that they become followers of men instead of followers of Christ.”
I agree. I think there is a great danger on creating “celebrity”, if one person is the reason a church has a “personality”
“Don’t even get me started on video preaching….”
Why not
Just to further clarify the Hillsong thing…
- Hillsong’s main church is multi-campus – Hills & City
- Hillsong also has the Hillsong Network, which is generally independent churches coming together for accountability, but they remain independent.
This latter aspect is similar to how Phil Pringle’s Christian City Churches work. It is now almost considered a denomination down here, due to it’s overall size and influence, while Hillsong itself (not necessarily Network members) are part of the Assemblies of God.
Confused yet?
David (@dg4G)´s last blog post…Snubbed. Gobsmacked. Bewildered.
Haha!
We have something similar here in the states. The Calvary Chapel Network, claims not to be a denomination, but inevitably, there are structures, doctrines and rules that would say differently. When they “plant” a church. They take on the typical planting model. Which is to send someone out and dissect them from one covering to become independent. But, they must adhere to the original beliefs and doctrines of the Calvary Chapel Network of churches to be considered one.
Correct me if I am wrong, but the main campus does video at times. Correct?
Yep, sometimes…and they use LOTS of video in their services in general (of course), but at the moment, they’re aim is to have live preaching the vast majority of the time at both campuses.
Another interesting point…if the City campus keeps growing like it is, it will be bigger than the Hills campus in the not too distant future. Praying the legal ‘hooha’ over the building proposal is sorted soon for them (and the wider Church down under)
David (@dg4G)´s last blog post…Snubbed. Gobsmacked. Bewildered.
wow. it’s kind of incredible to me to hear so many people against video teaching. i think video teaching is a lot like *gasp* rock music in a church. it takes some getting used to.
at our church, video teaching came naturally. i mean, for any church out there that uses live video in their sanctuary’s already for image magnification, i dare you to ask your congregation what they’re looking it. i promise you 95% of them are staring at the screen already.
for us, we weren’t/aren’t trying to reach the people who would *gasp* at video teaching. our mission is to reach the spiritually restless and unchurched, so frankly the people who have issues with video teaching aren’t our target audience anyway.
as for “reaching out and touching a pastor,” that’s what our amazing campus pastors are for. they’re the ones the in community. and our senior pastor makes it a point to visit our satellite campuses whenever he’s not teaching on a weekend.
now, the best situation is what we’re going to be moving too soon, where EVERY campus becomes able to be a “sending” campus for live video over ip. our teaching pastor will literally be able to teach one service at location 1 (which broadcasts live to location 2) at our 5:15 saturday service, drive to location 2 between services, teach live at location 2 at the 7pm service which then broadcasts to location 2.
i think the people that are quick to dismiss video teaching may not entirely understand it or see the big picture. we’re trying to take the church to the people, period.
joshua´s last blog post……man, i need to live in oregon
Joshua, I would go on to say that every church is completely different. And each one has a flavor. Video is truly one of those flavors…today.
absolutely!
joshua´s last blog post……man, i need to live in oregon
it’s interesting too, because there’s people who will be at the multi-site who come up and ask to speak to the pastor…after about 5 min. they forget its video anyway.
Mike, what makes you think a satellite campus is not a church plant? Just the video portion?
Maybe we’re talking semantics. I would say if a church is under the control of another location for all descisions,including leadership choices, financials and vision-casting, then they are a satellite. If they form their own visions, make their own ministry choices, handle their own finances, and have their own identity, then they are a church plant.
Another distinction would be the chain of oversight. Suppose Fellowship/Denomination A opens church B in a city. Church B grows ’till busting, and sends people to open campus C on the other side of town.
Does C’s oversight come mainly from A or B. If it’s B, then it’s a satellite. Notice I said “mainly.”
The fellowship we belong to has thirteen or so independent churches. We have one church that was planted by people from our congregation. We “oversee” that church in terms of some financial support, events we do together, mentoring for their leaders. But the pastor of that church is accountable to our overseeing fellowship (our bishop), not to our church (our pastor) even though it was our church (our pastor) that sent him. Make sense? This is a church plant.
If that pastor were accountable directly to our pastor, I would say it was a satellite.
“Don’t even get me started on video preaching….”
Why not:
To me, this trend toward “video preaching” is truly a cult of man. If a church has not trained up a leader who can craft biblical sermons, then they need to focus on edification and equipping, not expansion.
Mike Mahoney´s last blog post…The Music Licensing Quagmire – Part 1 – A Primer
I agree with the differences you have stated as to what a “plant” and a “satellite”. I would say that there is some “in between”. I don’t disagree with either the plant or the satellite. I think that comes from the make-up and style of the church. For instance, our church is one that is growing and out of room. It would make sense for us to expand both here and somewhere else. We have a relatively small valley. For us, it makes sense to have multiple campuses under the same church. It would be operated as a “joint venture”. Never it’s own entity, but very much with it’s own culture.
“To me, this trend toward “video preaching” is truly a cult of man. If a church has not trained up a leader who can craft biblical sermons, then they need to focus on edification and equipping, not expansion.”
I am not sure I would classify video as a cult of man. we have video studies and bible lessons and movies and kids teachings and seminars and more. I would hardly classify it all or nothing. I would absolutely agree that a leader(Pastor//Elder)needs to be qualified and should teach. That’s Biblical. What would be man made is the need for that person to teach every Sunday AM. Maybe the discussion over video “pro or against” has a lot to do with what you consider a Sunday AM looking like on your campus. As to that, there is no Biblical model. The early church met continuously..all week. Sunday AM, wasn’t the focus. I would agree with that model and would say that Sunday AM, is only one aspect of what we do as a church. so to say that our leaders have to teach then, cause it’s Biblical, would be a stretch for me.
Easter 2010: We’re launching a satellite location 20 miles south of where we are. We have a good group of people that come every week from there to attend the “main” campus. They (and a group of volunteers from here) will be the launch team. It will be like a plant but without all the struggle (well most of it) that most plants from scratch have.
There will be a campus pastor whose main function will be to pastor people. Not to speak (preach). We will have “God on video.” Haha. 1 week delay. Granted I know some of us old fashioned folks think a “pastor” is synonymous with “preacher” but that’s simply not true. Should they be able to encourage and share scriptural truths? You bet. Does it mean they have to do it once a week all packaged up in bullet points? I think not.
Anyways, good discussion going on here. We are STOKED about spreading our realm of influence. And really excited that our main campus will bear the bulk of the financial investment to get this thing started in the community a little south of us.
Russ, I am excited for you guys and anxious to see how this all goes for you.
GCC has a video campus that’s held in a movie theater in a neighboring city. They record one of the Saturday night services & play it at the Sunday service at the movie theater. I thought the worship would be weird, but it’s not.
The model of GCC works, so instead of re-creating the wheel they did it via video. It’ll work for some, but not others. Depends on your crowd & which folks you are trying to reach.
With money as tight as it is..especially in ministry..Granger did it in a low cost, but effective way.
They may change it down the road, but for now it works. They’re finding other theaters to work with in neighboring towns as well. It’s a great way to expand w/ out the expense of a new building. They’ve also blessed the theater w/ a major weekly cleaning. I know they focus on blessing the theater owners as well as the people in that specific city.
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“With money as tight as it is..especially in ministry..Granger did it in a low cost, but effective way.”
this is huge in my book. I believe we should have more impact in communities. Living there, working there. But money should not be the determining factor…of at all.
I wouldn’t agree with Mike’s assessment of video teaching as a ‘cult’ (though I do agree with most everything else he shared), but do see the wisdom of his statement that followed:
“If a church has not trained up a leader who can craft biblical sermons, then they need to focus on edification and equipping, not expansion.”
We DO already have leaders who are ‘trained’ and very capable, but of course they have to be willing. It’s easy to ‘get comfortable’ in the present role of ‘following the leader’ and not want to risk the change of ’stepping out of the boat’ on your own (even with the oversight of the present leader).
‘Sorry to hear the ‘plant’ is a definite ‘no go’. ‘Guess we’ll just wait to see what it really is… and keep praying for God to be ‘in control’ of it.
D-
“If a church has not trained up a leader who can craft biblical sermons, then they need to focus on edification and equipping, not expansion.”
at what cost?
screw the unbelievers… we have to get better at creating leaders?
joshua´s last blog post……this type love (for ryanne)
Dana, I agree with Mike’s statement, but in context I can’t support it as a Sunday AM idea. I don’t believe that is Biblical. That a “leader” needs/has to teach on Sunday AM, is a man made thought or doctrine.
Also, if we, as a church do this, we have not determined whether or not we will teach live or by video. There’s a lot to discuss before we even get to that point. “method” is not where we will start in discussion.
And, I would agree with you that we have many wonderful teachers and we should use them more.
possibly unrelated… but this quote from craig groeschel slays me every time i read it. i just happened to be at lifechurch when he gave this message (called unstoppable), and it was absolutely epic.
“…and let me just say, to those of you who are self-centered and small-minded and say ‘this church is too big for me,’ don’t come back. I mean, get your whining butt out of here. Seriously. Let me just say this to you as well, when you go to a small church that meets your needs, make sure they’re not reaching people for Jesus. Make sure they’re not, because if they are they’re going to grow too and they’ll be too big for your self-centered little butt again! Oh yeah, welcome to LIfeChurch, we want to make you feel comfortable and happy with yourself. You know, I’m serious… quit your self-centered whining. Do you think that the Church exists for you? No, you’re the Church. You’re the Church. As long as there is someone who doesn’t know Christ, don’t ever say any church, any where is too big.”
as far as i’m concerned, the key in that (and how it relates to this topic) is:
“Do you think that the Church exists for you? No, you’re the Church. You’re the Church. As long as there is someone who doesn’t know Christ, don’t ever say any church, any where is too big.”
joshua´s last blog post……man, i need to live in oregon
yes, yes!!! that IS epic!
your awesome wife´s last blog post…what an introduction!
the whole message was incredible tam. if you ever get a chance, i’d recommend checking it out.
http://www.lifechurch.tv/message-archive/watch/unstoppable/2
joshua´s last blog post……man, i need to live in oregon
cool. we’ll watch later!
your awesome wife´s last blog post…what an introduction!
Side note…Craig is at Hillsong Conference this year…I can’t wait. I nearly fell off my chair when they announced him at last years conf! Woohoo!
David (@dg4G)´s last blog post…Snubbed. Gobsmacked. Bewildered.
Josh, I’m not into ‘jousting’ if that quote was in response to my comment. Obviously, and understandably, you’re passionate about your position, so I didn’t take it personally =).
I think there is a balance, and Mike’s description of the ‘Hillsongs model’ is a good example of that, if we feel one is needed other than the Biblical one (which it seems to follow).
I don’t know how big their ‘church network’ is but I’d wager they’re reaching plenty of ‘unbelievers’ as well as discipling believers to reach more.
Also, B, I’m confused about what you thought was unbiblical,
– training, equipping, and edifying leaders to be sent out? I think that is part of the Great Commission’s definition of ‘making disciples’. Granted, the first step is conversion, but it doesn’t end there. We need to be doing both as related to the ’stages of development’ as they progress.
My point was we DO have capable leaders already to ‘go out’ into the community to ‘plant’, ’satellite’, or whatever you want to call it , without having to use the video feed concept (and Sat PM would be fine if you have objections to Sun. AM – though both are ‘Biblical’ =). That’s just my ‘vote’, and my personal commitment schedule would work better for Sat PM if you want to pass that along too =)!!
D-
My point was regarding whether we use video or not. Whether we have a live teacher or a video teacher (which still is live…with live video broadcast) in context of Sunday AM. I don’t think there is any Biblical basis to say we need a live person on stage Sunday AM.
And, we do have many capable leaders at TRF. I agree. And those leaders from TRF would be the ones “sent out”. But it still has nothing to do with video. That’s a preference. I understand it wouldn’t be yours. And, it won’t be others as well. But, we aren’t trying to reach out to those that are already here
We will always have live teachers, but video may be involved. Whether we setup a satellite campus or not, video and live will always be involved.
not jousting at all…
it wasn’t “meant for you”
joshua´s last blog post……man, i need to live in oregon
Having set up and worked in a “Video Venue” for three years, I thought that I might add what I saw happen there.
The idea was originally “One Message, Many Locations”, but what happened was disconnect. Being intentionally planted in the “poorest, Urban” neighborhood in town, messages didn’t translate as well as they would have live (i.e. tithing messages). The pastor on the screen didn’t connect. What happened was in the end we planted to be live and intentionally in the neighborhood, rather than a “satelite feed”.
During my time at the Video Venue, I was offered a job to help as a worship director at a Video Venue for New Hope in Kapolei, HI. Rather than “One Message, Many Locations” they had a live preach on days when Wayne Cordeiro was off the island. This I thought worked better because their pastor, who knew the people and culture personally, was able to speak to them.
I think that the Satellite campus can happen, but it would help if you found a balance and didn’t rely solely on the video to do the “preaching” and if the venue could find their own identity.
my two cents.
Ron Pai´s last blog post…Sunday Set List 2/1/09
Ron, I would agree with you. I think there can be a healthy balance between live and video and multiple teachers. most importantly the campus Pastor being involved in that routine.
I can also see, how planting a church in an Urban area like you did, could really lead to disconnect. Glad to see you guys made adjustments to fix that. I think that is key. When you fail, you adjust and try again.
I think one of the things that keeps coming up in this thread is the whole “pastor versus preacher” thing … I whole heartedly agree that those “giftings” aren’t necessarily going to be in the same person. We all know incredible, gifted communicators who lack the pastoral care elements, and vice versa – some of the best, people-loving, pastoral care pastors around who struggle to communicate a basic sermon in the pulpit.
If we can do multi-site, and it’s effective, and people’s lives are being changed … isn’t that the whole point?
I often hear the argument that a video campus elevates the “speaker” or “communicator” and doesn’t make a place for those gifts to come forth.
That can be true, but look at Jeff Henderson @ Buckhead .. he’s a great communicator, and speaks live some … as a matter of fact, last time I visited Browns’ Bridge (another NP campus) in G’Ville, Jeff was on the video teaching.
Pray – seek God, and don’t throw a stone .. do what God shows YOU to do. Don’t just copy everyone else – keep it real for YOUR culture. That’s my $.02.
Fred McKinnon´s last blog post…What Songs are you TIRED of doing?
Amen Fred…
this comment is full of win.
joshua´s last blog post……man, i need to live in oregon
“I wouldn’t agree with Mike’s assessment of video teaching as a ‘cult’ ”
Perhaps the “cult of man” comment was a bit harsh.
What I was trying to get across was that if a person would rather go see Reverend SuperEvangelist on video than a real live flesh-and-blood minister, I consider that following the man, not the message. In that case there is a danger (and it’s not necessarily the case in every instance) that the person delivering the message has become more important than the message itself.
“If a church has not trained up a leader who can craft biblical sermons, then they need to focus on edification and equipping, not expansion.”
at what cost?
screw the unbelievers… we have to get better at creating leaders?”
Joshua, I would say that if the church is not creating and equipping true leaders, then they ARE screwing the unbelievers… and that they have little hope of retaining them.
“Dana, I agree with Mike’s statement, but in context I can’t support it as a Sunday AM idea. I don’t believe that is Biblical. That a “leader” needs/has to teach on Sunday AM, is a man made thought or doctrine.”
Brent, you are right. The REAL work of the church should not be done during a Sunday morning service. But… whenever the fellowship chooses to gather, there should be edification for the body. That is biblical.
Mike Mahoney´s last blog post…The Music Licensing Quagmire – Part 1 – A Primer
Mike, I know churches that don’t do video that have the “reverend Super Evangelist” issue as well. So I would agree with you, except that it has nothing to do with video. Video can keep the message clear, it can also distract. But, that only happens when the live guy being recorded is keeping it clear and no distracting.If it’s wrong before the camera rolls, it will be wrong after it rolls.
“But… whenever the fellowship chooses to gather, there should be edification for the body. That is biblical”
Absolutely! But, again, this has nothing to do with video.
I like turtles.
Great discussion going on here. Lots of food for thought for our transition.
Russ Hutto´s last blog post…Friends of RussHutto.com
What I want to know is if you will be using turtles in the new campus
I actually attend Lifechurch.tv, and we do have people at the individual campuses speak “live on location”. It is something that doesn’t happen every week though.
One thing that I enjoy is that I can go to multiple campuses in the Greater Oklahoma City area, and each campus will have a different feel to it. Music really sticks out more than anything as far as the atmosphere at each campus, but the campus pastors and staff also create a different feel as well. The pastors have a huge hands-on approach at the campuses, and do a great job of reaching out into the community.
The video teaching for me is just as effective as seeing the person on stage, and those that attend our campus respond to it. We average probably about 3500 at the campus weekly, and I have yet to be at any service (youth, adult, mission outreach) that someone hasn’t accepted Christ for the first time. It says a lot since I have been attending for over 3 years. What makes the church effective in my opinion is that Lifechurch is seeker sensitive. So many of our churches today are concerned more about developing programs within the church rather than outside of the church. The church members are more concerned with “What can you give me?” rather than “What can I give you?”.
Jason´s last blog post…Nameless
this comment, is also full of win.
joshua´s last blog post……man, i need to live in oregon
I like being able to hear stories right from where this is happening. Thanks for sharing.
I am also pleasantly surprised to hear of the different flavors Lifechurch has even with the same vision and leadership and teaching. I like that.
Inevitably, like Ron Pai was saying, I believe you have to and will need to cater to the area you are in. The demographics and the culture. As well as, that may even determine, like in Ron’s cae, as to whether or not video will be a viable option.
Having worked for a multi-site church for the past 7 months, I can say that I find the “movement” fascinating! Seacoast Church didn’t set out to be a multi-site church; they were experiencing wonderful growth a few years back, but when they petitioned the city, they were denied the necessary permissions to expand their facility… rather than turn people away, they rented a pad in a near-by strip mall and added additional services, with a live worship team and teaching via video.
The second campus came about when a friend of our pastor (another pastor) called him and said that he needed to get out of the ministry and wanted to know if Seacoast would “adopt” his congregation… not wanting that group of people to be without leadership, they became the first “distant campus”, in that they were about 90 minutes away.
To date, we have 13 campuses (counting our Internet Campus) in South Carolina, North Carolina, and Georgia. I would never suggest that multi-site is the best model for any church, but I have seen it work here and in other areas.
Steve Murphy´s last blog post…Co-workers, food and laughter
Steve, Seacoast is an AMAZING representative for those who want to learn about multiple venues. It is amazing to see what is happening out there!
Well… Our church is going multi on Easter morning. I am on the “plant” team at New Life Rancho San Diego. I cannot wait. Our pastors will go between campuses to preach, although we do have a campus pastor for everything else. We have two worship teams, one completely mobile church on wheels since our 2 nd location will be in a movie theatre. This weekend We will pass 5000 door hangers, I hope to have legs by Sunday. I’m excited, nervous, and really eager, and I love the fact that God is stretching me PAST my comfort zone!!!
Heidi´s last blog post…My Life Lesson From My 8Yr Old
Heidi, Awesome!
If there is anything I have heard about multiple campuses, it is that you will be stretched. But with that, comes amazing blessing as well.
Wow! What a great discussion, Brent! I have never attended a multi-site church or one that used video preaching. I’d be open to it, although I know it would take some getting used to. This conversation has been so interesting and educational – good stuff!
Mary @ Giving Up on Perfect´s last blog post…Carnival Week: Things I Love Thursday
we are attending a large church, that also has another site..it started as not enough space and already has 5 services. Its Bible teaching, and sound. Its reaching the community, and has another site now in a neighboring city. All services are piped in via satellite, and live in real time. They do have a group of workers from the home church, and possibly it could be come its own. It now has 500 people attending..i have had some different thoughts on it, but now i see it as “the workers are few..the fields are ripe with harvest” more of a resourceful way to get it out and touch more people. As long as the Gospel it going out, and discipleship is in place..I think it is typical of God to work out of the box. just my two cents…i am not bothered by this at all!
darla´s last blog post…FUN FRIDAY FRENZIE- FINISH & START
Darla, I love your heart. I love that churches are thinking outside of the box method wise!
Whew! That’s a lot to read. I didn’t get through all of them. However, since this is “your experience with”, I’ll go ahead and comment…
I attend a multi-campus (location) church. It started off as one site. Then someone approached them about having another location. The pastor was driving like a mad man every week to be “live” at both campuses. Eventually more people in farther areas were looking to have a campus at their location. God opened these doors. The campuses were too far apart for more driving. Funds were provided to set up what I guess would be called satellite churches.
We now have several sites including an internet campus and home churches. The senior pastor does the preaching with each site having it’s own set of pastors and volunteers. All services are live except for our Wednesday day iCampus service. However, the iCampus pastor and volunteers are live even then.
I am not sure how the house churches work the worship music – in-person or via satellite – but I know the other campuses have live music (obviously the net campus is streamed) and switch over to satellite stream for service. Then each campus pastor does the “closing” (there for prayer, tell of up coming things locally, baptism, and so on).
It works out well especially living in the middle of now-where tiny town rural America. An hour drive down winding roads can be a long travel… especially if you are inviting others to “go sometime”.
Previous “series” are available on to buy on DVD or to watch for free on website.
So, I guess we have a bit of it all. Live, In-Person, satellite, and pre-recorded.
As for fellowship and hands on… You can still pray for any pastor without touching them. You develop relationships with those at your “campus” – whether it’s a person’s home, the internet, or a designated building. So, you still have all that “shook the pastor’s hand” ability if you want… it just probably won’t be the one you listened to for the last half hour…
L of WayTMI´s last blog post…super quick post
“As for fellowship and hands on… You can still pray for any pastor without touching them. You develop relationships with those at your “campus” – whether it’s a person’s home, the internet, or a designated building. So, you still have all that “shook the pastor’s hand” ability if you want… it just probably won’t be the one you listened to for the last half hour…”
I agree with this. It often seems that the first people to complain that there is a single teacher(talking about video venues)…are the first people to complaint that there isn’t a single person(personality) that is touchable at each site (even though there are).
Brent,
What is the primary reason behind the explosive growth of the multi-site church movement?
Leadership Network asked 1,000 multi-site churches in 2007 the reason they went mult-site. The overwhelming response was “evangelistic outreach.”
Going multi-site is not a facility, zoning, financial, video, mega-church, or ego-driven strategy. It is primarily an outreach-driven strategy.
What began as a band-aid for mega-churches because of space constraints or zoning issues has now become a viable strategy for any healthy church regardless of size.
Healthy, growing churches have a passion to reach people far from God and multi-site is a proven, cost-effective strategy to reach more people with the good news of Jesus.
That’s why every growing church in America is either already multi-site, planning on going multi-site, or thinking about it. Today over 2,000 churches across the nation have embraced some form of multi-site.
Multi-Site is not for every church.
It will not turnaround a broken church, restart a dying church, or grow a stable church.
It is a cost-effective strategy of healthy congregations to reach and serve more people by leveraging the strengths and ministry best practices of a local church.
Love the dialogue!
Jim Tomberlin
Multi-Site Church Pracititioner and Consultant
“Going multi-site is not a facility, zoning, financial, video, mega-church, or ego-driven strategy. It is primarily an outreach-driven strategy.”
This is truly my heart and the heart of thoe I know that are doing multi-site.
Jim, thanks so much for stopping in and joining the conversation!
I know i am joining this waaaay late in the game, and may not have anything to contribute, but the church i work at is a multi-site church. We have one main campus with 4 other campuses…one in town and the other 2 are 45 mins away and the other is 2.5 hours away.
we do it kind of interesting…the only staff for those campuses is the campus pastor. everything else is volunteer staffed. for us, it is a duplicate service…worship is a live band doing the same set list and the message is a video. One of our campuses (in town) is a fiber line to that campus, the other 2 are done over satellite time we buy to transfer it and they DVR it and play it back. our 4th campus has a video driven from our main campus each Sunday.
So…we know all ways to get the message there. I would love to help in any way i can.
I personally love the multi-site concept…it allows you to get closer to the people you want to reach. LOVE IT!
Lynse Leanne´s last blog post…Twitter Weekly Updates for 2009-05-10